25 replies to this topic

[MickeK]

I had a small conversation with G Spinning in in his posting about the 67 Historical update that are better suited in a posting of it's own. I was totally unaware of methods to edit in the GPL images before I recently did some work to put personal name stickers, ans a small flag on "my" car in 67Hist as well as creating a helmet of my own. And get all this reflected over the different races.

This was a bit of fun to me so I was thinking of doing the same in 69X. From that point-of-view the postings below was done and I copied them in here just to start a new thread in the subject. I problably will run into some new questions later and hopefully some of you more skilled editors are able to help me and anyone else interested in the subject.

-- Post 1 ----------------------

Humble question to G. Spinning as you are a master on my subject:

Recently I read the posting about name tag on your car and that resulted in a new experience to do some fun stuff. So I worked a bit on my Lotuses and helmet. Resulted in this https://srmz.racesimcentral.net/inde...attach_id=23391 .

As I also very much like the 69X, and read some textfiles with your signature in those folder as well, I just want you to tell me if it's possible to

1. Find your own helmet and edit it?
2. Find your own different (in my case) Matras and edit them?

The differances between wha't installed in folders related to 67Historical and 69 (the folder is NOT named 69X but I still have the latest great update and it runs well) confuses me a bit. Rearding the cars bodies there aren't any such mip-files to find, expept (sursprisingly enough) a couple of car mips of one car (can't recall right now). Searched the rest of my GPL installtion folders but cannot find any. So Graphics must be "hidden" somewhere else, perhaps in those bigger "dat" files?

When it comes to helmets all the other driver helmets mips are present, but not any player helmet. I've also scanned all the helmets and no one looks lika the one on my head (driving the Matra MS80). That's a White one with a mid golden strip.

So if you just can tell me if or of not it's possilble to do a little personalization in the 69X MOD as well? I know you've don work on the car bodies there but is it possible without some advanced programming skill?

Most thankful if you can advice me. Either I start to do some nice work or I understand I have to let it be .

-- Answer ---------------------

Micke, may be you are a bit off-topic here regarding how to edit 69X helmets. I would reccomand you to open a new topic and I am sure you will get even more people helping you.

Nevertheless, yes it is possble with the same tools you used for the 67, i.e. Winmip or Datman.  To find your helmet It is just a bit more complicated than with the 67. In the 67 you have 7 car folders  in each carset having most loose files. In 69X you have 45 car folders. The textures files (car skins, helmets etc.) are either loose in the folders ( usually these are the updates)  or are packed in the dat file.

When you will unpack the car dat file, you will find all the textures you are looking for. Then, comes the fun because there are mips which are shared among more cars, and you probably know that GPL ignore a second file when one with the same name has already been loaded.

Enjoy it.
Gf

-- Post 2 ----------------------

Thank's a lot G. I'm sorry about a beeing a bit off-topic, even if I found some connection with the comparison in the differents structures between 67Hist and 69X. I cannot express how good those are and what an edge you did apply on the old 67

I guess I try to copy in these postings and create another topic somewhere else.

Anyhow the guess about the dat-files where correct and I found the DATMan as well. Did a quick test of the Matra MS80 in folder c06 and edited the 27 car image as well as the helmet described as driver helmet in the 3do. Just rough input of some colour on some intersting spots of the car and copied one of Icxs jet helmets as driver helmet file. It's seems almost perfect except from some strange appearances of the helmet... ...but, that can be a floow up in the new topic. Anyway, find this amusing .

--------------------------------


...and now we can take it from here

Edited by MickeK, Mar 10 2013 - 06:14 AM.

[G.Spinning]

Micke, continuing our conversation, be aware that the 3d models of the brabham's helmets and matra open faces in 69X are different from those of the other cars. Therefore the textures editing for those its more specific. Anyhow you just need to see the existing ones and try yourself.

Have fun.

[MickeK]

I guess that's what made some strange helmet when I copied the Ickx helmet to the Matra. Was going to experiment a little but now I know this fact. Most helpful. Is it possible at all to create one jet helmet (from a for example Matra driver Stewarts Jet helmet) and then let that helmet be players helmet in all the races? Was thinking of those textures, are they different between the different Matra MS80's?

Edited by MickeK, Mar 10 2013 - 09:01 AM.

[G.Spinning]

MickeK, on Mar 10 2013 - 08:42 AM, said:

I guess that's what made some strange helmet when I copied the Ickx helmet to the Matra. Was going to experiment a little but now I know this fact. Most helpful. Is it possible at all to create one jet helmet (from a for example Matra driver Stewarts Jet helmet) and then let that helmet be players helmet in all the races? Was thinking of those textures, are they different between the different Matra MS80's?

In principle it is not possible. You have to use the texture base of  the helmet model which is called in the car 3do. The Matra's use two different helmet 3do models and you cannot change that.

[MickeK]

Ok. I skipped the idea to use the same helmet in all races and was aiming at creating helmets to the two different models and later find out where they are used. Not sure if you include the jet helmet. Noticed that as some kind of upgrade to MS80 at Monza. Anyway I thought of start with that one and design a Ronnie Peterson inspired jet helmet to my player, used from the c25 folder.

No problems at all with the MS80 #27 car bodies. Easy to put a name and a small flag on all variants of the car and get them displayed (as seen at Monza below) by including an edited c2527.mip in the c25.dat. No problems with the helmet either but the face image doesn't behave... Here are the facts:

-----------------------

The c2527.3do file says: c25 c2527 zh04face zh04helm

I used Mr. Stewart and his jet helmet in the Monza race as template to design a jet helmet of my own. Below you can see the Stewart originals and my versions. As I understand it Stewart got his jet helmet as an update (there's a short info from GS about that) and those are not included in the c25.dat and has the root folder c25 as adress.

So I tested the most logical way to put my two files, named according to c2527.3do in the root as well (remebering GS's note that GPL uses the first load if there are multiple files and assuming that this was the first load here and used to upgrade). The result was the Q2 pic below.

So the helmet file was accepted and displayed but the face file ignored. The face used seems to be same as Stewart. So why are my face file replaced with that one? As Stewarts face file matches mine there should be a texture match as well. BTW I cannot find the default player jet helmet (GPL written on sides), but it doesn't matter as long as my replacement worked anyhow.

Then I tried to replace the zh04face.mip within the dat file as well as the next most logical thing to do. No success. The result was identical to the first attempt.

The Q1 pic shows the bmp originals to the mips. I included the zh04face.mip within the dat file that looks like a face I don't connect as my driver at all.

So now I'm stucked. And still it seems close enough some solution. Wasn't sure that the stripes was going to match between face and helmet and intended to find the perfect match but first things first. Is there any hope? My hope right now is that anyone knows and tells me .

Attached Files

•  Q2.jpg   120.4K   166 downloads
•  Q1.jpg   66.62K   157 downloads

Edited by MickeK, Mar 11 2013 - 01:42 PM.

[MickeK]

Not at all rushing anybody but 5 days and no suggestion? Perhaps too complicated to sort out? Can't be in Company with this expertise . When I solved this I'm done and so close now...

Edited by MickeK, Mar 15 2013 - 11:50 AM.

[ed76]

- Have you checked the exact file name by editing its face 3do (with notepad for example) the car player ?
- Are you on the name you gave, not a mistake or "white" added ?
- as though you used the same values ​​as the original winmip when you transformed your  bmp to mip.

if it takes the default face instead of yours, that is it can not find the mip  of the 3do or the mip have not the "good" format

[MickeK]

Excuse me ed but I don't quite understand? As I said in my posting the c2527.3do file (as I understand it "my" Matra MS80 at Monza) says: zh04face zh04helm. That's the 3do you're talking about?

And my edited face mip looks like zh04face.mip, as well as (the correctly displayed helemt) looks like zh04helm.mip as my jpg above shows.

I don't understand what you mean by "white" added but I can guarantee that the files are named exactly as this.

Are more files than those involved?

I used the same names as the originals as it seemed a smart thing to do instead of renaming the originals and the fact that some texture that other MS80 drivers in the race use might be misinterpreted according to GS's comment.

So I really do not understand what I can do more than this?

[G.Spinning]

Micke, I am sorry not to have the time to go in your details. I worked on the 69X 2-3 yers ago and don't remember all the details. But beside the fact you have been unlucky to start  with a special case ( I had to modify Stewart Buco jet helm model to make it looking like a  full face, and this applies also to the player), it seems to me that you have not selected the MS80 graphic option IT in your player option, but you are driving another Matra graphic at Monza.
Hope this helps.

Edit: I got it now. Because of car  c25 specificity  and the need of modifying the special Buco open face  helm (default in the MS80s) in a full face one, as Stewart had at Monza, the showing external image for Stewart and player helm is zhelmfrn.mip and not z04helm or zsteface. Zhelmfrn is called in the helm 3do, therefore you cannot have one specific for Stewart and one for the player. Player helm front (i.e. face) has to be white as per Stewart. The above should be valid only for car c25.

Edited by G.Spinning, Mar 16 2013 - 11:36 AM.

[MickeK]

Thank's a lot GS. Find you most helpful and I took a Little break with the Monza example. Instead aiming at the multiple use of CAN-USA-MEX car and player helmet. And with a Little bit of adapting to existant mips and Photoshop work I'm now satisfied with this result. The other cars comes next. Hopefully as smooth as this one was, then we'll see what I can do with the complicated Monza helmet.

Anyway, a big thank's GS for taking the time. I understand that those files where a minimal part of all the work you've done and I know how fast you forget in such a complex structure.

Attached Files

•  scndmp_final.jpg   121.29K   84 downloads

Edited by MickeK, Mar 16 2013 - 03:16 PM.

[MickeK]

Not that simple to get this right as I hoped after my 67Historical "introduction". The car as such with name tags works fine but the helmets and faces are sometimes a mystery. I understand that code in the 3do makes an influence but in some aspects I'm just confused of what I have in mips and what I see on screen.

I you can explain a bit it's great but you might as well tell me that this will never work. My car looks great in all races anyway. The helmet/face is perfect in c24 (CA-US-MX), ok in c06 (ES-ROC) where a front cover common with other drivers is added without that much of visible effect on my helmet. The c25 (IT) as we've talked about uses Stewarts "white front" and I've accepted that as well.

Next was c29 (MC). My helmet is red, as the h04helm.mip within the dat file and I identify a front cover just like the one in c06. A minor problem there. In c29 nothing(!) happens if I replace the player 3do files h04helm/h04face with mine. It shows the red helemet anyway. If I take that red helmet mip and put some colur dots on it doesn't reflect that either. There are no other red helmet graphic as that helmet in the dat. So from where does it display? In my World there has to be some file with that very same graphic - or can the 3do "create" a graphic of it's own?

Perhaps you can enlighten me, perhaps it's no use to even try to explain. Anyway I get curious so if you have some input I appreciate, as well as I do with all the answers already given even if I don't get a solution. Then I rest with what I have .


In addition I've edited the display of name and flag a bit. Found a more appropriate Matra drivers historical correct manner: Drivers flag + Tyrell team GB flag + France "manufactor" flag. So this is my car so far and more "historical" accurate even if the driver KALLMAN seldom did a F1 race back then

Attached Files

•  c24_MS80Scrndmp.jpg   120.68K   58 downloads

Edited by MickeK, Mar 19 2013 - 10:45 AM.

[G.Spinning]

Micke to change player helm and/or face in C29 , you have to change 04helm.mip and/or 04face.mip in car C09. Changing them in C29 does not do anything because GPL does not update the same  mip which was already loaded in its memory (C09 comes before C29).

Hope this solve your problem.

[MickeK]

Aha... I thought that GPL loaded only the demanded car set when you start a new session on the track. There's a bit loading delay there (especially in 69X) as we all know.

So if GPL load all the Matra MS80 car sets at start it's a completly different logic chain to follow.

Thank's a lot. A new strategi to work from...


PS. It's not that I can put a file I'd like to load early DIRECT in an "early" Matra MS80-car folder like the c06 (I guess you ment that as c09 isn't involved or do I have to check out every dat file all models)? It would save a lot time for each test of Changes, not to have re-create the dat files every time.

Edited by MickeK, Mar 20 2013 - 04:38 AM.

[MickeK]

MickeK, on Mar 20 2013 - 02:09 AM, said:

PS. It's not that I can put a file I'd like to load early DIRECT in an "early" Matra MS80-car folder like the c06 (I guess you ment that as c09 isn't involved or do I have to check out every dat file all models)? It would save a lot time for each test of Changes, not to have re-create the dat files every time.

I add this to the common knowledge base and quote myself. GS was totally right and the 04helm.mip/04face.mip was indeed loaded from the c09.dat in the c09 folder, even if I don't drive the car kept in that folder as the helmet in question is used generally by Matra drivers. And just great was to find out that putting my personal verions of 04helm.mip/04face.mip at the root of the folder instead of doing the full procedure to include them in the c09.dat was reflected in racing Monaco with the helmet of my own. As long as you make me think I get better at this, even if the structure of calling files is more complicated than expected.

As the c06 case it also add that special helmet front, but it's ok. If I find the original file for that in the first loaded folder I might edit it a bit though to better fit the look of my helmet. I think I can do that without "disturbing" the look of Mr. Stewarts and other Matra drivers helmets fronts. I just check out the Matra folders in order until I find the first representation of that graphic.

[G.Spinning]

I think you finally got it and indeed I wanted to reccomend you not to change the original dat(s). There is no need for it and if you do it then no one can further help you because you change the common reference. The loose files in the car folders overwrite those in the dat. But do not overwrite those with the same name if present in previous car folders, either as loose files or in dat. Further yes indeed GPL loads all car folders in alphabetic order, even if not used in that race. And for instance, if you delete any of the car folder you get CTD.

Car c06 uses gh04helm and gh04face for the player, if you make new ones and drop them in the c06 folder you will see them when you drive the MS80 ES-RAC.