23 replies to this topic

[DucFreak]

EDIT (06/Jan/2012): added more videos


Boys and girls, what works better for showing off "WIP" content than still-images (screenshots)?

.......yep, in-game videos!  

Following our WIP screenshot thread, we are starting this thread to show some short and honest pure gameplay footage of the upcoming P&G v3 add-on mod, all unedited:  

• De Tomaso Pantera "Boss" Gr.4 (1972) at Donington Park
  
• Shelby Cobra Competition 427 (1966) at Mondello Park
  
• BMW CSL 3.5 IMSA (1976) at the Nordschleife
  
• Ford Capri 3100RS (1975) at the Nordschleife
  
• Ford Escort RS (1971) at the Jarama track
  
• Alfa Romeo 2000 GTAm (1971) at Limerock
  
• Porsche RSR 2.8 (1973) at the Nordschleife
  
• Porsche 914/6 GT (1971) at the Nordschleife
  
• Abarth 1000TC Gr.5 (1968) at Varano Gimkana
  
• Mini Cooper 1275S (1968) at Crystal Palace
  
• Alpine A110 (1968) at Varano Gimkana
  
• Shelby GT350R (1968) at Laguna Seca
  
• Ford Escort RS (1971) at Varano Gimkana 2010 (external TV cam)
  
• Small fly-by caption of 1970's cars at Mid Ohio (external TV cam)

...enjoy!  


PS: some more "WIP" videos for other cars should be added soon.

Edited by DucFreak, Feb 14 2013 - 06:45 PM.

[Burnsy865]

    

[sky]

wow! amazing.

you know, if the cables underneath the dash of that beemer would move while drifting through the corners, i'd think there is nothing else you could add to get more realism from the graphics. top job!

[Stefan Roess]

Thx for the previews!
It looks great!

Can`t wait to drive it.

[Rudy Dingemans]

DucFreak, on Dec 26 2011 - 06:24 PM, said:

Boys and girls, what works better for showing off "WIP" content than still-images (screenshots)?

Releasing it.



2008:

WIP WIP WIP WIP WIP WIP WIP


2012:

WIP WIP WIP WIP WIP WIP WIP...



Regards, Rudy
(GPLRank: -40)

[DucFreak]

Rudy Dingemans, on Dec 27 2011 - 12:44 PM, said:

DucFreak, on Dec 26 2011 - 06:24 PM, said:

Boys and girls, what works better for showing off "WIP" content than still-images (screenshots)?

Releasing it.



2008:

WIP WIP WIP WIP WIP WIP WIP


2012:

WIP WIP WIP WIP WIP WIP WIP...



Regards, Rudy
(GPLRank: -40)

Heh.... very funny mate, but we're not going to release "Work In Progress" content.

[MECH]

DucFreak, on Dec 27 2011 - 01:27 PM, said:

Heh.... very funny mate, but we're not going to release "Work In Progress" content.

Speaking of funny.....i sometimes have these crazy thoughts.....right now i wish i was a headphone.
Dunno where that came from...


Nice vids btw. got any outside car shots? I'm more a fan of the carshape then the cockpit view

Edited by MECH, Dec 27 2011 - 01:54 PM.

[Art-J]

C'mon, Rudy, I'd expect to see this kind of comment from some teenage console racer, not from a GPL veteran. You know how long it took GPL '69Xtra to finally show up. Same thing with HGTTC (or HistoriX) mod. If You're into historic sim-racing, then You also know the "neverending story" of upcoming VLM Group C mod. Different platforms, different teams, different number of cars, yet obviously the same problem of very long development time. Do you expect P&G v. 3 to be different? I don't. Looks like creating a big (and I do mean BIG) mod with vintage cars for any platform, is always a few years investment. I'm definitely not happy about it, but I learned to live with it.

Besides, If Aristo says in his "bye" thread the physics is more or less done and the only thing left is some GFX content, then I presume they are really getting close to the release. That's also an impression I get from watching the vids above. Glass half-full for me. No offence, but Is it  half-empty for You, or You just had a bad day?

Cheers.

[JJManeschijn]

Looks and sounds awesome!! Thanks for the footage  

[Rudy Dingemans]

Art-J, on Dec 27 2011 - 02:20 PM, said:

C'mon, Rudy, I'd expect to see this kind of comment from some teenage console racer, not from a GPL veteran. You know how long it took GPL '69Xtra to finally show up

Hey, like GPL mods, in case of P & G I have very very little doubt that when it eventually shows up, it's probably going to be pretty good.

Doesn't mean that it isn't also exceptionally  *S   L   O    W*, comparatively.

My grandmother actually codes faster (and she's been dead for a while).

No, at this point, several years after 2010 (which is several years after 2008, when V.3 was originally incepted) I'm going to let my sarcasm have free reign every time I see *another* "WIP" post, after four whole years of previous WIP posts.   These chaps fully deserve all the credit, but they also fully deserve some good old fashioned heckling on this particular aspect by now.
After all, mods like P & G are proof that glaciers actually move pretty fast, relatively speaking.

Regards, Rudy
(GPLRank: -40)

[Stefan Roess]

Rudy Dingemans, on Dec 28 2011 - 01:03 PM, said:

Art-J, on Dec 27 2011 - 02:20 PM, said:

C'mon, Rudy, I'd expect to see this kind of comment from some teenage console racer, not from a GPL veteran. You know how long it took GPL '69Xtra to finally show up

Hey, like GPL mods, in case of P & G I have very very little doubt that when it eventually shows up, it's probably going to be pretty good.

Doesn't mean that it isn't also exceptionally  *S   L   O    W*, comparatively.

My grandmother actually codes faster (and she's been dead for a while).

No, at this point, several years after 2010 (which is several years after 2008, when V.3 was originally incepted) I'm going to let my sarcasm have free reign every time I see *another* "WIP" post, after four whole years of previous WIP posts.   These chaps fully deserve all the credit, but they also fully deserve some good old fashioned heckling on this particular aspect by now.
After all, mods like P & G are proof that glaciers actually move pretty fast, relatively speaking.

Regards, Rudy
(GPLRank: -40)

Sry, but I can`t hold myself back

Rudy, if you would pay the bills of all P&G crew members they won`t have to go to work anymore and could fully concentrate on editing...
ah, I nearly forgot, that some of them might even have other hobbies than editing, or might even have friends, families, ... so it might still not be that quick

Edited by Stefan Roess, Dec 28 2011 - 02:53 PM.

[DucFreak]

Rudy Dingemans, on Dec 28 2011 - 01:03 PM, said:

Art-J, on Dec 27 2011 - 02:20 PM, said:

C'mon, Rudy, I'd expect to see this kind of comment from some teenage console racer, not from a GPL veteran. You know how long it took GPL '69Xtra to finally show up

Hey, like GPL mods, in case of P & G I have very very little doubt that when it eventually shows up, it's probably going to be pretty good.

Doesn't mean that it isn't also exceptionally  *S   L   O    W*, comparatively.

My grandmother actually codes faster (and she's been dead for a while).

No, at this point, several years after 2010 (which is several years after 2008, when V.3 was originally incepted) I'm going to let my sarcasm have free reign every time I see *another* "WIP" post, after four whole years of previous WIP posts.   These chaps fully deserve all the credit, but they also fully deserve some good old fashioned heckling on this particular aspect by now.
After all, mods like P & G are proof that glaciers actually move pretty fast, relatively speaking.

Regards, Rudy
(GPLRank: -40)

I'm so sorry if we break your heart by "coding slower than your grandmother".

...problem is, this team right now is composed of a handfull of active members (when it used be well over a dozen of very active people for P&G v1 and v2, so untill 2009 or so).
Of those, at least three of them have also been working on other projects (for GTR2 or other platforms), and a couple of those also work for commercial projects, one at full time (Aris, as you all know now).
If you could see the ammount of work that gone bigger, with old and newer members quitting for whatever reasons, leaving things still to be finished, I guess you can understand how difficult it is for the small number or people that still remain for this.

It's very easy to be on that side and say "fark, these guys are working really slow!", when there's real life out there and other imponderables getting in the way of things, all the time.

Heh... about two months ago I said to another member of the team that we should write a freakin book telling the story of all the ups and downs with this project, it's that surreal.
One thing I know: It may take a while, and it might be "finished and released" later than it should have happened, but it is the product of a collective effort for our own interpretation of the "classic-racing sim we always wished for, but no commercial dev-team cared for".
It was so much easyer to quit, but the freakin thing is still up. Now, how about that, eh?
It will be done. Cheeky remarks or not, with your interest in it or not, melted glaciers or not.

It's not the first time someone posts the sort of crapp you posted, so perhaps Aris can explain it better than I ever could... here's the "version for the public" of it:
https://www.nogriprac...07&postcount=26

Edited by DucFreak, Dec 28 2011 - 06:29 PM.
added link

[sky]

hi,
thanks for your post and the link to the post at nogrip - interesting reads

your post and the the post of aristotelis over at nogrip reads pretty much feel like all mod teams face the same kind of problems and dilemmas (small wonder actually ). we've been there, done that. oh and the new recruits things is a phenomenon we've experienced too - a lot recently. people get invited, start working and after a few days or weeks drop of the planet with no explanation to the why or anything. sometimes it feels like they just wanted access to the mods before the official release, but that would be the negative-most outlook on that. i'm sure there are other reasons, personal life, work, ... but to be honest, even if that is the case i would still appreciate a little feedback before "dropping off the planet". but hey,
anyway, what always gets me, though, is that for the most part the work of those new additions to the team simply gets lost. you may see some progress shots before they drop off and then they're gone and someone else has to take over, starting over again - which is also not helping getting things done in a timely fashion. you do a lot of work several times over, which wouldn't really be necessary if things were working in a coordinated fashion and an ideal world .

as for releasing something that is not quite ready - i think there is a diffence in attitude between certain mod teams and the standard they set for themselves. your team, as well as "ours", seem to share the same view on things. there is a certain standard we would like to achieve or at the very least maintain from previous releases - and if the current "product" doesn't live up to these standards, then it is simply not ready for release and may take some extra work or, if nobody can be bothered to put in the extra hours and work, it has to be shelved. and you wouldn't believe how close to shelving certain things have come (several times). the thing most people out there do not realize is how much work actually goes into a mod and how much of it is repetitive and boring (and wears people out) but still has to be done. the last 10% always seem to take 90% of the time. you can get initial good results rather fast, but if you want to go further than just being able to drive "something" in a fashion remotely connected to reality and properly enjoy it because it feels "right" - then that's a whole different ballgame.

[MECH]

DucFreak, on Dec 28 2011 - 04:22 PM, said:

It's not the first time someone posts the sort of crapp you posted, so perhaps Aris can explain it better than I ever could... here's the "version for the public" of it:
https://www.nogriprac...07&postcount=26

Yeah, that sums up what i think of reactions like: when it's going to be finished as well.

Well that and this   (couldn't find the moonie picture sry)

Rudy well knows how much time is involved in modding so i can't understand him making a reply like that.
But he's done it before and i tend to ignore it (yet braking my own rule again)
In fact it's hardly motivating if you post some WIP stuff and then get reactions like that.

That's also the reason i don't post any mod screens anymore, fun has left the building


Keep up the good work fellas


{couldn't ignore it anymore, the pressure you know, the pressure....}

[Rudy Dingemans]

DucFreak, on Dec 28 2011 - 04:22 PM, said:

Rudy Dingemans, on Dec 28 2011 - 01:03 PM, said:

Hey, like GPL mods, in case of P & G I have very very little doubt that when it eventually shows up, it's probably going to be pretty good.
Doesn't mean that it isn't also exceptionally  *S   L   O    W*, comparatively.

If you could see the ammount of work that gone bigger, with old and newer members quitting for whatever reasons, leaving things still to be finished, I guess you can understand how difficult it is for the small number or people that still remain for this.

It's very easy to be on that side and say "fark, these guys are working really slow!", when there's real life out there and other imponderables getting in the way of things, all the time.

I know... I know about real life. And I think that once it's released, it's probably going to be a real achievement. One that will have a real chance of being counted among the best.

Despite that, though...
(compared to nearly all modders out there, who I've heard also have real lives)


Anybody ever tell you guys you are freakin slow?    


Regards, Rudy
(GPLRank: -40)

[Paddy the Irishman]

Rudy, why not stop digging......

[DucFreak]

Hello everybody,

Some more videos were added (see first post of this thread).  

Edited by DucFreak, Jan 06 2012 - 11:30 AM.

[DucFreak]

There's a new video added (see first post).

As usual, Mirza at the wheel.  
This time, something a little different...

As you might have noticed before with some of these videos, we're also showing cars that were already featured in P&G v2.
Before you ask, the reason for this is that all previous version cars have been updated for P&G v3 -some a lot, others just a little- so we think it's a good idea to post videos of those too (for current P&G users it also works as a "spot the differences" heheh).  

Edited by DucFreak, Feb 16 2012 - 01:14 PM.

[DucFreak]

New video added (see first post).

It's some tv-camera footage (so external, not onboard) of the Ford Escort RS at Varano Gimkana 2010, drifting and sliding with the default setup and hard tires.  

[Paddy the Irishman]

Wow, nice driving !

I have put my car back on the trailer and am heading home - couldn't face that opposition....