29 replies to this topic

[TurboMan]

Hello everybody,

i come here as it's the most trusty and friendly site i know. So i'd like to ask some questions about a bit of "special" installation of W7 i want to do.

Finally, after many years using, repairing, updating, etc a 2006 computer, my brother and i saved enough money to get a modern (2014-2015 range i'd say) computer and a proper display for gaming. The computer comes with Windows 10 Trial Version and i want to get rid of it. I own a Windows 7 SP1 "N" Version with it's corresponding product key.

The "special" part comes here:
It's a shared computer, what i want to do is having 2 HDD partitions, and install that W7 i own on both, selecting which one to use on the boot menu. My brother would get 2TB and me 1TB. I'm doing all this because of malware concers. My bro usually visits suspicious webs to download his stuff, install a lot of things (some of them include adware, etc), use P2P clients (in fact, 2 weeks ago had problems with a troyan in his current laptop), so one question would be,

if i have 2 separate installations of W7 on 2 different partitions but on same HDD, if one gets infected with malware, will it screw things only on that partition, or it could affect the other?

Other question would be, is it even possible to do that double installation? I think it is, but i'd like an opinion of more experienced users.

Also, if it gets done, will i have validation problems when activating Windows online? It's a legal copy, so no problems should appear from that side, but maybe there will be other conflicts, as it's the same machine running the exact same OS twice on different partitions.

Hopefully some people here know enough about this quite odd purpose.
Thanks to take the time to read

Edited by TurboMan, Nov 06 2018 - 06:53 AM.

[Cookie]

IMO the 2 partitions will not be able to protect you if a malware or infection gets hold of the 100MB systempartition W7 creates!
That systempartition will also be the main problem for your twin install..a second install would overwrite it without asking!.

The only way would be to use 2 HDDs with separate installs of W7 ( during install twin not connected!)

You could do a first full single install with registration and all things that should be same.

Then you make a full systembackup on an external HDD,
remove the first HDD and use the second empty HDD with the repair functions of the W7 install medium to make a clone.

After this you can connect both HDDs and select each in the boot menu F11 or F9 key selecting the boot device.

This will be a greyzone but imo no problem as the systems will never run at a time

Edited by Cookie, Nov 06 2018 - 07:38 AM.

[SV3000]

Same as Cookie, I use the exact same method to run win8 on my 1st HDD and linux on 2nd HDD. However, if i'm not mistaken, having both HDD connected on the motherboard while running a system from one of the HDD may not prevent the system (or malware) from accessing data inside another HDD.

One solution is to only connect SATA cable to your HDD (swap with your bro's) when you wanna play, then switching back once you have done playing. This way only one HDD is connected at any time, and no changes to bios or boot order (and never have to worry about what your bro's doing).  Just take some screws off PC case so you can disassemble enclosure piece easily.

Edited by SV3000, Nov 06 2018 - 03:18 PM.

[twinpotter]

https://www.howtogee...-your-computer/

https://www.tomshardw...-dual-boot-mode

TP 😁

[Cookie]

Or you use something like this: https://www.chieftec....es/cmr-225.html

[TurboMan]

Thanks for all the explanations gentlemen, you are the best
I was going to do the twin install without asking, but something inside me said i should gather some info first.

For now i'll stick with 1 HDD and 1 W7 installment. As it will be a gaming PC mainly, i told my brother to keep doing all his stuff on his laptop, and the safe things on the new PC.

TP, thanks for those links as well, will keep them for the future, i'll have a dual boot at some point, that's for sure.

That's an interesting gadget Cookie, however, even having some spare money to get a new HDD and the gadget, i'd like to save it for a cockpit i planned some months ago, similar to John Woods' one, i will need a seat from the scrap yard, wood, screws, etc. Much appreciated anyway

[Stefan Roess]

As the others have written before.
I also think that you can not completely prevent the whole PC from getting infected by a virus or malware, even so you have two hard drives, each one for a user.

A solution would be, like SV3000 wrote, to switch hard drives. But then you have to put it in and take it out every time you switch between you and your brother. This can be annoying when you have to open the PC case and switch screws. But there are solutions like Cockie has linked to. But then you have to invest more money.

The easiest, cheapeast and safest solution would be that your brother is simply NOT allowed to download any " " on that PC. He can do this on his laptop. Your race PC is just for racing for you both. Nothing else.
Then you just need two partitions on the same hard drive with dual boot menu at PC start where you can choose one or the other partition.

You should be able to activate W7 online at least on one partition/OS. For the other partition/OS W7 has a phone call function to an Windows employee that will register it for you, if I remember correctly (at least it was possible back then when I had W7).

Good luck.

Edited by Stefan Roess, Nov 08 2018 - 07:30 AM.

[MLGathome]

Windows 7 support stops on 14-01-2020. No more safety updates after this date.
You should consider to go for a newer OS, Windows 10.

Greetings, Marcel

[TurboMan]

I've got Win 7 running. Now, another question arises:

The computer came with a "Intel Motherboard Drivers and Utilities" CD. When i bought it, i asked the guy at the store if it was needed to install but told me it was already installed, ready to use. Should i reinstall those after the Win 7 installment?

I formatted the HDD partition when i was asked to select the partition where to install Win 7, but don't now where all the motherboard drivers are stored. I'm a newbie at installing operating systems, slowly learning

MLGathome, on Nov 07 2018 - 04:44 AM, said:

Windows 7 support stops on 14-01-2020. No more safety updates after this date.
You should consider to go for a newer OS, Windows 10.

Greetings, Marcel

Nope, not going to move to Win 10. The computer had it installed from default, i've been using it for 3 weeks. I got rid of it, don't like it. Same happened with Win 8 and Win 8.1. Will move to a more modern OS when Microsoft release one i like. For now, Windows 7 is perfect. Also use Win XP and Win 98 on other older machines for testing other stuff, don't like any other Microsoft OSs.

[Cookie]

When you formated the HDD nothing will be left,
so use the CD to get the driver but do not let the intel CD install all the useless spyware they want to...
or let win7 get the drivers automatical, the only driver needed from the CD is the ethernet LAN driver.

Newer intel systems do not officially support W7 anymore, so a special procedere will be necessary!
I just did it with an Apollo Lake sys
Give us the specs of this PC please

[SV3000]

Usually you can download specific driver from the company/brand (such as HP/dell etc) who made your PC, just go to their website and usually there is a section called "support/download/drivers", there you can search for your PC model and it will give you all the drivers that suit your PC spec (and matching windows version).

PS: however they probably won't provide drivers of older windows version for newer PC.

Edited by SV3000, Nov 08 2018 - 06:29 AM.

[TurboMan]

Specs:

CPU: Intel Core i5 4590 3.3 GHz (4 cores)
MB: MSI H81M-E33
GPU: Nvidia GeForce GTX 1050 2 GB GDDR5
RAM: 8 GB DDR3 1600 MHz
PSU: 500W 12 cm
SPU: Integrated HD Sound Card 8 Channel Dolby 7.1
HDD: Seagate 3 TB SATA 7200 rpm
Network Card: Integrated 1 Gbps
OS: Windows 7 Professional SP1 "N" Version
Optical Unit: LG Super Multi DVD-RW 18x/22x
Case: NOX PAX ATX Mid Tower Chassis

Also will have to take a look at the drivers of the GPU. It gets to the correct resolution (1920x1080) but it doesn't fills the screen (tried changing the settings on the TV, but that's not the problem, it's correctly setup).

Edited by TurboMan, Nov 16 2018 - 10:21 AM.

[Cookie]

Ah ok, no problem with W7 for this SYS

Nearly my race PC... (i5-4670 on B85N with GTX 960)

Consider to use a small 128GB SSD for the system incl GPL, as this would speed up your PC enormous!

For the screen size look for the NVidia settings "overscan" (not at my PC with NV GPU atm...)

Edited by Cookie, Nov 08 2018 - 08:30 AM.

[TurboMan]

I've never been a fan of SSDs, only for portable USB devices. If i'm not wrong they wear much faster than mechanical ones, and i like things last as much as possible (Still posting from a 2006 laptop ). I have no problem waiting some minutes for loading OS, tracks, etc. Still, will have them in mind for the future.

Thanks Cookie for the Nvidia tip, will have a look at that and see if it solves the problem.

[Millennium]

Modern SSD's last much longer nowadays and they are more reliable too. SSD life expectancy was a problem when they were a new thing like 10 years ago, but not anymore. If you get a good brand like Samsung they will often easiliy last for many years. I would defenitely not recommend using a mechanical drive for the OS today, it's such a pain in the ass. I have a couple of Samsung SSD's, including one from 2011 and never had a problem with any of them. (Most of my mechanical Seagate and WD drives went bad or became unreliable after 2 or 3 years.)

The only real downside of SSD's is that they don't give many warnings when they are going bad (unlike a 'clicking' hdd for example). Once a SSD is dead it's really dead and there is no way of getting anything back, but that's where backups are for ofcourse.

Might be worth a watch:
https://www.youtube....h?v=-XZNr7mS0iw

Edited by Millennium, Nov 08 2018 - 11:09 AM.

[Cookie]

I confirm that the short living of SSDs is fake news!

I never had a failing SSD using them in 4 PCs as system disk, but ~ 15 failing HDDs made me loose some data in the last ~20 years.

[SV3000]

Depends on build quality, and HDD requires extra care (must avoid shaking while powered on, otherwise can break very fast). I have like 3 HDD broke so far in the past 20 years, 2 of them were laptop's, which caused by constant shaking, they wore out pretty fast, desktop PC usually don't have this problem. (PS: My current 2nd 320gb HDD was bought in 2006, still in very good condition, running linux atm)

[TurboMan]

Another question, what should i do first, [Windows Update] then [Drivers + Antivirus + Utilities], or the reverse process?
I think Windows Updates first of all but it's better to ask before.

Many people use SSD for the OS and programs installed, and HDD for external/secondary storage. Probably will go for that scheme in the future. Build quality and correct use and mainteinance would be enough for both to keep them for years. For now, will stick with this HDD. Anyway, SSDs should get cheaper through these coming years, plus i don't need a huge amount of space, so in the end it shouldn't be a problem.

[twinpotter]

I would definitely do the Windows updates first, along with the AV. Then drivers and utilities. IMO.

As far as SSD drives you would have a better system with more response. Please take the advice. Well worth the upgrade. As for wearing out I'm not aware of this. I only know and learnt that if you fit one don't maintain by defrag, as that doesn't need to be done and can damage your ssd.

TP 😁

[Daniel0099]

Stick with Win7 as long as you can.

I bought a new powerful PC (many times faster than my old one) and installed Win10, and I disabled updates to avoid the problems others have with updates in the background. But I found that I had to run GPL at a lower Res to get the 36FPS. After long investigation, didn't find any problem with the install.

So I managed to install Win7 (dual boot) on that same new PC (Same hardware for both OS). To my surprise I could run GPL at full Res (twice the resolution than Win10) without problems. Beside I don't do updates very often to avoid spyware and when I do I choose what I'm updating.

I have SSDs in my PCs and recommend it. Had one for about 3 years now and had no problem. Litterature says it will last longer than HDD. Files (and Track) loading is a blast but that wont improve your FPS.


Good luck

Dan